This episode's guest is Dr. Turquessa Francis OTR, EdD who is the assistant director at the University of Buffalo and the writer behind the OT Research Corner blog. Turquessa and I discuss the various types of activities that make up evidence-based practice and adjusting mindsets around some of the barriers that are currently seen when attempting to be an evidence-based practitioner and what that actually means. Turquessa gives some great tips and tricks for how to incorporate these practices into your daily routines.
Turquessa's Blog: OT Research Corner
15-30-45 Minute Rule Blog Post
Open Access Journals Blog Post
Follow Turquessa on Instagram @otresearchcorner
Questions or comments? Contact Katie at katie@otgraphically.com
Welcome to the OT digest podcast. I'm your host, Katie Caspero, the founder of OT, graphically.com. Where I synthesize research into visually appealing graphics on this podcast, we take research and make it more fun and interesting in order to quickly hear the most updated evidence all around the world. I interview authors, share research tips and provide practical examples.
That I hope he can use and incorporate into your interventions the very next day. Thanks for listening.
Well, welcome everybody to, um, we're doing a little bit of a evidence-based chat to me. Um, my name is Katie. I'm the founder of OT graphically. And this is Turkey. Tessa. Do you want to introduce yourself? Hi, I am. Marchesa Francis. I am a. At the university of Buffalo. And I also run a blog called, uh, OT research corner.com.
Yeah. And I'm I met you through, cause I noticed we were posting very similar things and had similar, um, ideas and I just loved what you were doing. And um, it's just, if you go on the blog, I'd highly recommend it. Cause there's a lot of great resources there. Oh, thank you. I love your work as well. I really do talented.
I feel like you got the text and I got the visuals, so I know, I know we could do something together or we can really do something that's for another, another conversation. I know, I feel like every time I have a meeting with someone, I come away with a few more projects that.
Awesome. Well, today we're going to talk a little bit about kind of what, um, evidence-based practice means and what that looks like. Um, and I have never personally been a professor, but Theresa has, so that's nice to have that perspective. Um, so I'll maybe share what evidence based practice means to me.
And then we can. See what you have to say too, and we can go from there. But, um, to me, I think it means, um, just really analyzing what I'm doing in the clinic and making sure that it is up to date, that it is valid in that it is proven it's works, you know, to the best of our ability for what, from what we have available.
Um, and really being intentional about that. And, um, Being consistent. And when it's, when I feel like I get stuck, you know, go back and see if there's something new or fresh that I, that I'm missing. Um, and always being kind of in that, because things change by the day. So how about you? What does that mean?
You know, I share the same thoughts as you. Um, I think of evidence-based practice really as using assessments intervention. That have been found to be effective using research methods. And I think I liked the way you described how you use evidence-based practice in your clinical setting, because really evidence-based practice can look different.
Depending on the clinician, the setting interests practice area need, but what's consistent is the practitioner uses research to guide the clinical practice, which is exactly what you said, you know, just a different way of saying it. Um, I also like that point about being intentional. Sort of always reassessing what you're doing and making sure that it's up to date based on what's out there, uh, within the field.
Um, so definitely good points. Do you feel like when were you, um, most interested in evidence? Have you always been, or is it something new? Um, I've always been interested in evidence. I think that's why I went back to my terminal degree. And wanted to learn how to just, you know, sort of consume and apply research, you know, just more effectively.
I do have to say though, over the years, my view of, of research has, uh, how I, um, sorry, consume and apply. Research has changed quite a bit and meaning that I think. Be that person that felt that research needed to come from the ivory tower and research needed to come from peer review journal articles, uh, consistently.
And I didn't look at other areas of research such as like what you're doing, your pod. When you speak to researchers and you talk about their research, how they apply their journey, that's all part of evidence-based practice. And that was not my thought process in the beginning, but it's grown over the years for sure.
I don't know if those tools have been around either. Um, I was coming out of school. I don't think there was a podcast or that just wasn't, um, method. The OTs haven't gotten had gotten into yet. Yeah. You know, it's funny. I think a OTA had a podcast for a little bit are related to evidence. It was sparse. It wasn't as consistent as it is right now.
They had it, but it's the same thing. Like our mindset was not what you can spare evidence. We can spare more coming from a research article standpoint. And a lot of the times it's just people won't have time to review the research articles, but they have time to listen to a podcast. They have time to read maybe a shorter article and say like an OT practice.
That uses a different method of research. Um, it's less stringent, but still there. Um, and I think people have just changed their view on how they consume research for the good, definitely for the better, for sure. Um, and on how they apply it in their clinical setting. Do you think it's because there's more information out there.
To go through or do you think it's the same amount we just are busier? Yeah. I think it's the same amount, which is busier. And I think the producers are kind of recognizing that and saying, Hey, you know, this is catching on this sort of shorten method of presenting research is caching on. Let's get it to the people because in the end, if you're producing this research as a researcher and no one's consuming it and applying.
It's not really getting to the people. I mean, we don't, it's not a vanity project. When you do a research project, it's definitely to help people. And so whatever way the person feels comfortable consuming, it needs to bring it, bring it to the person in that manner. Um, so I think it's just the same amount.
They're just thinking of different ways to present it to people. I think. Yeah. I like how you said, bring it to the vertical. I think that is. My, what you described as kind of what is, um, I have a very specific professor in mind and that is her story. She had great research and just never got to the right people.
Um, and then someone else did something that was very similar and kind of got all the credit, you know, not that it's for credit, but it's just like, it just hurt my heart a little bit. Um, and. I would hate to have some work their whole life on some, like, you, you gotta really specific about what you're studying and you dedicate your lives to it, and then it never gets used.
So that's just sad. Yeah. It is difficult to sort of understand that. I think that a lot of the times, like, um, because I look at a lot of research journals, I'll see one topic say in an open access journal, which I'm passionate about open access, and that will be downloaded. 500, 600, 700 times. And then you'll go to like an article where you need to have, need to pay for access, like for paywall kind of thing, same topic, maybe like 10, 15 views.
And it's like, it's all about access and what's important to people and how you present it. So, I mean, I don't know it is unfortunate, but that's how we are as creatures for everything. If it's easy for us to get to, if it's an, a matter that we understand. Gravitate towards it, consume it and then apply it.
We kind of need to respect that about people as well. Then last night, when I talked about the ivory tower, I kind of recognized, oh, everyone's not really reading journal articles. I kind of need to expand my understanding and expand my application and expand my reach. And so that's part of growing as a clinician as well, and as a researcher as well.
So yeah, that's difficult. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know if many people know this, but it actually costs a lot of money to put a research article in open access. And I think a lot of researchers take that hit themselves, which is sad. That seems backwards to me, but yeah, it's expensive. Um, just for my own personal experience, sometimes from age out, I think it costs like a thousand dollars.
Um, the more, um, like the open access journals. And we have $300 per author. So it's expensive. It's expensive. Yeah, it is. Unfortunately. Um, however, um, some grant proposals allow for authors to researchers to include that in their grant request to make it open access. And so that's an option as well for researchers who want to have a bigger reach.
Yeah, that's cool. I didn't know. That makes sense.
I love how you were saying, you said this phrase a few times, um, like in provided in the method that people, can you say, you said that, so, and I'm saying it, I wish I paid closer attention to what I was saying. I guess provide it the preference or the, the way they consume it. Um, Maybe that's what I said.
Yeah. Like in the way that works for them, I guess. Yeah. The way that it works for them best. Yeah. They were expressed for them. Yeah. Um, I think that's important for us to understand is, you know, a lot of people that they, the thought of reading a. 15 page research article is daunting to them, but out of reading like a one page summary of it is just a lot more like appealing to them.
Doesn't make it any worse as long as they apply it. That's what really matters. So as a priest recently, well, what are you researching? Right? So my focus is on literacy and the role of occupational therapy, particularly literacy engagement and its impact on reading achievement. Something that I, I just finished and I'm working on trying to, uh, publish that particular research article.
That's uh, that's awesome. I'm really interested in literacy as well, especially with COVID and a lot of kids not receiving like early literacy that they need a number behind them. I'm finding that very fascinating. Yeah. Yeah. It's a huge, it's a huge like passion project of mine. Just based on like what you said, especially during this time, there's like an equity with access.
So literacy tools, it's populations, and I've seen the impact greatly. I agree with you completely, definitely an issue. It's just really interesting for me to hear kind of what's going on in universities and what's coming down the line. Cause I think, um, that is like another way to kind of catch people and implement things quicker because if you already know it's coming out, you're gonna look for it and then you want to read it and then we are, or are you even going to like start being more interested in that and look for other things.
So, yeah, I agree. There are a lot of niches that are growing right now. Think that literacy is one of them. Um, health literacy is another related to literacy. Um, even today I went to a talk today with, at work and they were talking about, um, universal design, the person who spoke was an urban planner who was looking at inclusive design.
And she said, it's burgeoning. It's like at the tipping point. Where everyone is recognizing that it's important for us to look at inclusive design and everyone's now like coming towards her to figure out how can they do it within their building. So the cusp of that you're so right, is being able to be ahead of the curve.
You know, consume the information before that we, when it sort of hits that tipping point, you already have all that background information. I think it's like at a tipping point where people are like, how can we help these individuals? And these children learn because what we're doing is not working as an OT can come in and say, well, you're not modifying the task properly.
And your outcome is just not realistic for the physical. Cognitive ability of this child. Let's try to figure out another way to help them read, because what you're doing is that working. And I think it's coming at a tipping point as well. I see a lot more literacy articles than I used to before. So for sure, you're right.
Oh, that's really cool. And my sister is a literacy specialist in, uh, educational system. So it's really interesting to talk to her about that too. And sometimes GX talks about her damn, like you're being an OT and you're like, it's just interesting to me to hear her story. And well, do you have any other you've said a few, but do you have any other tips or tricks or if people are really struggling with using evidence?
I feel like a lot of times I hear. The phrase is that time, of course is a challenge, but, um, an access, but I think just the intimidation factor can be really tough. Um, I remember at one point when I just like, wasn't really in the evidence, I didn't have time. I just was like, oh, the article looking at articles, the last thing I want to do, but you have any, any tips or tricks with that.
So one of the things I think is important for us to sort of recognize like ways of dealing with barriers and like my biggest thought, right. Or tip, I guess I could say is recognizing that we need to change how we think about evidence-based practice in the sense that it doesn't need to look like.
Pouring over research on a daily basis because when someone who is working 10 hours a day with the mask on and everything, and has had a really, really difficult day, their thought process at the end of the day is not, I need to go read a research article, like there's thought processes. I just want to go to bed.
But if you can think about research as just. Uh, lifestyle, right? Where you put little chunks of time and address and consume research in those little chunks of time, and then apply a research as you can within the field to the best of your ability, then that will be, you will be able to be more consistent.
We don't need to think about research as how many articles did you read? To chunk out two hours of your time for you to be able to read an article, you know, you need to be, you need to make sure that you're up to date on all the topics that are going on right now within your field, thinking that way. So one of the things that I had done was I did, I'm very like, like a very concrete person and I thought.
I'm going to break down how to make time for research and the sort of structured way. And I did this, I had a wrote a little post about it, where I, I did the 15 30, 45 roll. So 15 minutes a day, no, sorry, 15 minutes. Once a week, you look at your schedule, you lay it all out. If you're a school-based therapist, you look at your IEP dates, your intervention dates, everything for that.
If you're a clinician, you look at, you know, you're think about the amount of evils you have per week, but that down, and you have, you know, who you're going to see for that week. You put that down. What you're looking for within that 15 minute period of time that you're using to look at your schedule chunks of time in your schedule, where you're open to allow you to consume research.
So that's 15 minutes. Once a week, we all have that 30 minutes every day. Read write review some sort of platform on occupational therapy. I personally liked Twitter because Twitter allows for shorter characters and they have links that are available. So you can click on, you know, British journal of occupational therapy when they release their, um, There's your drills monthly.
You can click on that link and see what's available for that month. 30 minutes a day. That's lunchtime scrolling on your phone, being in line, scrolling on your phone. That doesn't take a lot of time. And within that 30 minute period of time consume a good amount of information going on within legislation to impact your practice, to impact what you need to focus on.
As a researcher, you can do that. We all can find that. And then the largest chunk of time is that 45 minute time period. And that's going back to this thought of not having to consume, like pour over research for hours per day and have that in the back of your mind, 45 minutes once a week, which I think we all could find in our time, right.
Look, take our 15 minutes to kind of chunk it out 45 minutes once a week. Review an article of interest to you based on your practice area, based on your interests. And that's something that you can do. And I think that's how I would allow people to look at that time component for them to be successful.
I love it because it's not something that says make time, you know, make two hours, make it happen. Say, you know, you're busy. Look for that chunk of time. Take a day 30 minutes. Just consume little bit at a time, take once a week, 45 minutes, go more in depth to look at something free, to be able to apply to your practice specifically.
So that's how I deal with that. Sorry, let me get some, and you have a blog post on that? I do. Yeah, the 15 30, 45 minute rule. It's really memorable. Yeah. Um, it should patent that I should 1530. I like the math, if a two big multiples of 15. And we're always thinking in units too. So two units, three units once a week, once a day, three units once a week, that's it?
Yeah. Even smaller. Yeah, exactly. So I like that. And that's what. That's awesome. Six, I think you mentioned too, the daunting component aspect of that information in there, right? Like, oh, P values and, you know, T T to test to T test statistic or, but also they have in there that whenever we're looking at statistical correlation and all that stuff, Really you need it.
We've been trained right from first two to six as well. We all took psych fats, prerequisite for OT school. For most schools, we all did some sort of thesis or some sort of research project as part of our degree as well. We have the knowledge to understand the material. So we have that, that basic knowledge.
So my thought process with that. You don't have to look into the minutiae of information when you're reading statistics, you really don't. You can look into that simple little statistically significant, and the researcher tells you, and you can run with that and say, okay, this works for me is statistically significant.
The population is the population that's in my clinic. I can work with that. The math, the measures are something that I can use within my clinic. I can work with that. The intervention is something that's doable. I can work with that and just accept that and go with it and see how it works within your clinical setting.
Because another thing about evidence-based practice and you know, this, if it works for someone in the research article, it may not work for your client in. So you're still taking data on whether or not it works for you or not. So it's a process. So don't feel overwhelmed that you don't understand the material.
As long as you understand the bones of the article, the bones of the research. Apply it and see if it works, collect data modify, as you need to. Another thing is if you don't feel comfortable with that and you want to make sure that you really understand the research article, look at the discussion section, the researcher does all the work for you with analyzing the information, analyzing where the limitations are, analyzing, how you can apply it to practice all that work is done.
So we can just lean on the researcher to help guide us in that way. It is. That's my thought with, with that. Yeah, absolutely. I think, um, I always am like, oh, they did this statistics. That's good. And then I move on. Well, obviously I look for, you know, whether it's significant, but you know, there's a lot of letters that don't look like letters in there and things I don't need to know.
Yeah. You really don't because it doesn't impact your practice, right? Like if you're a researcher, you definitely want to be in the minority. If you're a clinician, you don't really need it for you to be able to practice. So don't let that bog you down as well. I think the thing about research, like you said, it's like people have these preconceived ideas and that bogs them down before they even start now.
Um, so that's unfortunate change the mindset and definitely, I think a lot more people will be open to. To just recognizing that they are and can use clinic, uh, clinical evidence within their practice. Yes, for sure. Yeah. And it's really important that we do and then share it with the researcher. Like, I, I think a lot of times we think there may be in an ivory tower or not, um, accessible, but they love hearing from you.
I feel it all the time from me all the time. So I think, um, when that bridge is broken down and. Or, you know, that bridge is created can really be powerful because we have a lot of valuable information for the researcher to you are so right. Because really when you reach out to them, I'm sure they're super excited or they are thinking, well, my goodness, I want this to be applied in practice.
Clinician is reaching out to me for clarification or someone from the nation or whatever, you know, that's exciting to them. In a community really, of clinicians and researchers working together to impact practice. So you are so. So it's all right. I agree with that a hundred percent. Yeah. I've, that's kind of like my dream.
I have a little bit kind of on my website right now, where I have a few infographics to try to spark discussion and kind of hoping one day, you know, researchers, clients, and clinicians. Talk together and learn from one another, because you know, at the end of the day, w that information will only speed up that process of the researcher research, being more implementable, because we'll be able to actually like form what their next project is, which is kind of like, I agree.
That's another thought of mine with helping people sort of. Like bridge that gap with research is having an accountability partner. And there's always someone in your clinic, like, like, um, like a alumni, someone that you graduated from who likes research. No, make a connection with that individual, discuss the research, discuss it on a walk or in a talk, or, you know, in the clinic to see what's going on and ways of that you can kind of impact the practice with the research that you've read.
Um, that's another way of cutting down research consumption because you can split it between the two of you, as opposed to just one person consuming. All of that, um, goes along the lines of like journal clubs, also being one area where. That's another way to sort of build a community around research. Yeah.
I love that. Like going for a walk with old friends, you know, I think I've missed a lot of those connections I made in school, but to rekindle, some of those relationships would be really, really cool. Um, That's awesome. You have really unique ideas. I've not heard anyone talking about, take them and run with them.
Oh, you're so kind. I'm just nerdy
and we all are a little bit. No, T I think we love, we love being in OT. I agree. I agree. Um, another thing I thought about a CEU that a lot of people tend to think of CEOs as. CEU and, uh, checks a box of meeting for NBC or T and their state, but a lot of the present tech presenters put in so much background work, researching their topic for application that it's really, they do all the work for you.
You show up for an hour or two, get all the information, apply to practice. See if it works for you, modify as needed. I think people need to recognize that Caesar or another area where you can grow. And the news evidence as well. Um, they're like researchers as well go up to, um, uh, presenter, interact, ask questions.
They're always open to discussing how it works for their practice, what worked, what didn't work, their journey, their information, um, and have that discussion with you as well. So I think CEOs are another area where, um, we can use that information to impact our craft. Yeah. What I hear you saying is that our, our vision or our understanding of evidence-based practice is maybe like this small, but it can be really expanded to some of the things.
And we're probably doing it a lot of it already. Right, right. I agree. I agree. And another thing I like is, um, your infographics. I think that, and your infographics are amazing. Like it's like putting this before. This is not something new, but it's. He somehow makes static like structures or static beings, like dynamic, right?
Like it's amazing. Your little squiggles, like show what works, what does it? And it's amazing because you could conceivably look at your infographics, like within an hour, like within an hour side within attendant. And get a complete research article and being able to apply it to practice. And I think that is another.
Like way that we can learn from research is through using like infographics and podcasts and things like that as well. So I wanted to give a little shout out to you before we ended. That was my shout out to you as well. That was unsolicited. So I appreciate that lesson. It was definitely unsolicited.
There was no money under the table. I appreciate that best kind though. I've never heard it described like that. Yeah. That's really helpful feedback. Being, I can't think of the word, but it's a static being that's dynamic based on how you use your little text and structures and things like that. And I think that's wonderful.
Yeah. I very much feel like I'm telling a story. Yeah. That's how I frame it in my brain. Yeah. I agree.
Yeah. Yeah, no, I I've been, um, I've been enjoying it. I feel like I feel much more connected to the evidence when I do it too. So I like would love to, I would love a bunch of people to be able to do it, you know? Cause when you do that, then you really understand it because they have to really know it in order to create that or else you're, you know, you're going to get stuck.
So. That's another thing I like about it is that you can tell that you've actually read and reviewed the material. And that's why it's so dynamic. It's because you're taking those words and verbs and you're like those verbs, I'm putting it on that infographic. And I think that's its major. Um, and it's definitely a talent.
Thank you Henry. I appreciate it. A few minutes. Um, before we wrap up here, do you, is there anything like last minute or anything you want to share before we end about, you know, where it can find you? Anything else about evidence-based practice? No, I think you, we mentioned access and just being able to get access.
And I think that we've discussed that at nauseum. I think everywhere about open access and different, uh, resources are available. If you want, I can provide some resources. I know that when you do a podcast or whatever, you have the and stuff on little links to places that you can go for. Open access articles.
I think that's one of another limiting factor is access for individuals. Yeah. That's a tough one. Cause it, it's pretty, it's pretty big bef factor and it's the first factor. Right? So if you can't get any access, then the rest of the things can happen. Yeah. I think there's some myths about that. That people think that they can't get access.
They only have some limit options for open access. There are a lot of options for openings and there's a lot of app options for access as well. I think I've mentioned that if you keep your email current, you can get access to the library for many schools, um, depending on, um, what alumni relations work out with your particular school, you could have an act you could have access.
As long as you keep signing in some schools are different. Another way of getting, um, access, uh, is as a field coordinator, a lot of times schools because of the shortage, um, uh, fieldwork sites. Um, schools are allowing fieldwork educators to get access to like library and stuff like that. So that's, you have a great blog post.
And then I created a graphic based on that blog post I'll make sure to kind of link those things. And I always were kind of bouncing ideas off of each other all the time, which is kind of, yeah, I agree. Yeah. I agree. I think somehow our paths are gonna cross later on down the line. Organically. Yeah. So it's so cool to meet people online and then be able to meet and work together.
And it's just the power of, of this past couple of years is amazing. .